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Post by lawrence on Nov 29, 2017 3:58:53 GMT
This discussion begs the question. How long should a symphony be? Or how long should a movement be? The shortest symphony I can recall is Sibelius' last symphony, about 20 minutes and Prokofiev's 1st, also about 20 minutes. I can't recall any symphony over an hour. Many movements are as short as 3 minutes and as long as 20 minutes. I think the attention span of the listener should be taken into account, and for this I think we can use television as an example. What's the average time between commercials? About seven minutes, probably that is also the length of the average symphony movement. T.V. programs are usually 30 minutes for sitcoms and light dramas. More dramatic programs require an hour. Beethoven's symphonies are all about an hour. That is about the longest an audience will stay attentive to a particular style or genre of music. Of course we must allow for potty breaks, stretching, conversation, so a two hour symphony without a break is too long. Thirty minutes is probably too short to fully engage the audience especially in a more dramatic symphony. IMHO Beethoven had it about right. Holst's the Planets is about the same, seven or eight movements each seven or eight minutes long. What say ye?
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Post by Mike Hewer on Nov 29, 2017 15:09:34 GMT
I suppose a work ends when the composer feels as though he/she has had their fill of it. I agree Lawrence that audience attention span can be a limiting factor, but surely that is also dependent on how cogent the writing is. If compelling enough (and appealing), one may be able to strain the attention a little further with well written and devised work. Still, I agree that the greats in the main, have it about right in terms of timings for concert hall music, although it has been found that attention wanders occasionally with individuals even in shorter works and so one must strive to keep listeners engaged for a successful outcome. The duration of a work is also decisive when it comes to the listeners information processing and can influence the complexity of musical material and its development. As always it is a balancing act for the composer, who has to manipulate a given length of time into a satisfactory, engaging piece. There are exceptions to the average lengths of works, one thinks of Messiaens' Turangalila symphony (10 mvts) which is about 1 hour and 18 mins, Havergal Brians' Gothic Symphony (even longer), Mahler and Bruckner, to name a few, but their works are compelling enough to warrant their duration in my view.
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Post by fuguestate on Dec 11, 2017 21:34:46 GMT
Yeah I was about to say, Bruckner's symphonies tend to be generally an hour or sometimes longer. And Mahler's symphonies tend to be on the long side too. Oddly enough, I'm perfectly fine with listening through a long Bruckner symphony, but a Mahler symphony, sad to say, makes me start looking at the clock and wondering when the ordeal will be over.
But I understand that my opinion is in the minority, generally speaking.
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